c4countdown

I know many people think stemming is useless, but which stem roots come up most often and are presumably the best to learn? Also, does anyone know of a way of testing your stems? I attempted to learn the entire RETAINS + ? + ? this morning and most are pretty hazy.

I use this method to learn and retain new words.

Charlie Reams wrote:http://wiki.apterous.org/Fruitful_7s

That reminded me of the Irregular Plurals page. A few other irregular plurals I've noticed that aren't there are AMBON - AMBONES, TELAMON - TELAMONES, NOPAL - NOPALES etc.

Actually I suppose generating a list of those would be really hard.

Charlie Reams wrote:http://wiki.apterous.org/Fruitful_7s

I'm not into apterous, and I don't know much of the background to this, but is it really much help to know you can add any vowel to RETAINS? I once had a bash at the dictionary listing and fairly quickly found about a hundred nine letter words containing those seven letters. Is ANTISERA so vital when you've probably got ABSTAINER, ASCERTAIN, STERADIAN . . .?

David Williams wrote:

Charlie Reams wrote:http://wiki.apterous.org/Fruitful_7s

I'm not into apterous, and I don't know much of the background to this, but is it really much help to know you can add any vowel to RETAINS? I once had a bash at the dictionary listing and fairly quickly found about a hundred nine letter words containing those seven letters. Is ANTISERA so vital when you've probably got ABSTAINER, ASCERTAIN, STERADIAN . . .?

Yes it is. RETAINS+E was on the show quite recently and I wouldn't have got it without having learnt the stem. I've also found the CANTERS and HASTIER stems pretty useful. I don't learn many stems, but the fruitful 7s are particularly good, as during a round you can know for a fact that the stem you're trying to recall does actually exist.

Martin Bishop wrote:RETAINS+E was on the show quite recently and I wouldn't have got it without having learnt the stem. I've also found the CANTERS and HASTIER stems pretty useful. I don't learn many stems, but the fruitful 7s are particularly good, as during a round you can know for a fact that the stem you're trying to recall does actually exist.

Presumably the other letter was useless. In general TRAINEES is unlikely to be the only eight, and chances are there is a nine - NECTARIES, RESINATED, RESEATING, TREENAILS etc. I take the point about it being easier to drag a word from the back of your mind if you know there is one. That happens to me a lot, and I don't even know stems! I think every time IDOLATERS has come up I've got one of the eights first, and then remembered the combination.

David Williams wrote:

Martin Bishop wrote:RETAINS+E was on the show quite recently and I wouldn't have got it without having learnt the stem. I've also found the CANTERS and HASTIER stems pretty useful. I don't learn many stems, but the fruitful 7s are particularly good, as during a round you can know for a fact that the stem you're trying to recall does actually exist.

Presumably the other letter was useless. In general TRAINEES is unlikely to be the only eight, and chances are there is a nine - NECTARIES, RESINATED, RESEATING, TREENAILS etc. I take the point about it being easier to drag a word from the back of your mind if you know there is one. That happens to me a lot, and I don't even know stems! I think every time IDOLATERS has come up I've got one of the eights first, and then remembered the combination.

You're assuming I can be bothered to learn all 12 stems from TRAINEES/RESINATE.

I don't know you David but you sound like a grumpy old man.

Ryan Taylor wrote:I don't know you David but you sound like a grumpy old man.

I don't know you either, but you're a fine judge of character. And I wasn't even trying to be grumpy this time. I'm genuinely interested in what would be the most productive way to study, and I would have thought the effort to remember all the words containing RETAINS would be among the more likely ways to gain an advantage.

David Williams wrote:

Ryan Taylor wrote:I don't know you David but you sound like a grumpy old man.

I don't know you either, but you're a fine judge of character. And I wasn't even trying to be grumpy this time. I'm genuinely interested in what would be the most productive way to study, and I would have thought the effort to remember all the words containing RETAINS would be among the more likely ways to gain an advantage.

You must be right. Probability wise they are the most likely letters to emerge. Personally, I love using stems and would advocate their use for any aspiring player. This idea got shot down by players like Corby and Reams but those losers never won a series so I'd take their advice with a pinch of salt.

David O'Donnell wrote:

David Williams wrote:

Ryan Taylor wrote:I don't know you David but you sound like a grumpy old man.

I don't know you either, but you're a fine judge of character. And I wasn't even trying to be grumpy this time. I'm genuinely interested in what would be the most productive way to study, and I would have thought the effort to remember all the words containing RETAINS would be among the more likely ways to gain an advantage.

You must be right. Probability wise they are the most likely letters to emerge. Personally, I love using stems and would advocate their use for any aspiring player. This idea got shot down by players like Corby and Reams but those losers never won a series so I'd take their advice with a pinch of salt.

Amazing.

David O'Donnell wrote:

David Williams wrote:

Ryan Taylor wrote:I don't know you David but you sound like a grumpy old man.

I don't know you either, but you're a fine judge of character. And I wasn't even trying to be grumpy this time. I'm genuinely interested in what would be the most productive way to study, and I would have thought the effort to remember all the words containing RETAINS would be among the more likely ways to gain an advantage.

You must be right. Probability wise they are the most likely letters to emerge. Personally, I love using stems and would advocate their use for any aspiring player. This idea got shot down by players like Corby and Reams but those losers never won a series so I'd take their advice with a pinch of salt.

I don't think I've ever out-and-out shot them down, I just wouldn't advise it as a particularly good way to 'train' unless you're already at a certain level. Didn't this conversation come up in Sudbery's thread? She spent time learning stems, when a few of us told her just to improve her all-round spotting by playing lots of rounds. Some of her stem practise came up in her game, but she missed them, I would guess because her ability to spot the root word wasn't up to scratch. That's the kind of thing I'm getting at.

I do like some stems, where it completely changes the word to the extent you almost have to double-check that it's true. I can't think of an example off the top of my head though.

GUITARS+S = SASTRUGI always surprises me, and has won me a few rounds where I would definitely have been stuck on 7 otherwise.

Playing is obviously a lot more interesting than learning lists, but just how often does a word like SASTRUGI come up? Compare that to the number of times RETAINS appears, and the confidence of knowing that you are word-perfect. SNGUEATRI - no problem!
http://wiki.apterous.org/Episode_4097

David Williams wrote:Playing is obviously a lot more interesting than learning lists, but just how often does a word like SASTRUGI come up? Compare that to the number of times RETAINS appears, and the confidence of knowing that you are word-perfect. SNGUEATRI - no problem!
http://wiki.apterous.org/Episode_4097

Haha. I had actually looked at ANGRIEST prior to this show as it is very stem-rich (for some reason I also got fixated on SCENARIO), and SIGNATURE is a good example of an 'unlikely looking' stem IMO. Got more and more flustered when I couldn't even see an 8 I knew was there (was toying with RANGIEST and GRANITES but decided to play safe) to even begin looking for a 9.

Jon Corby wrote:

David Williams wrote:Playing is obviously a lot more interesting than learning lists, but just how often does a word like SASTRUGI come up? Compare that to the number of times RETAINS appears, and the confidence of knowing that you are word-perfect. SNGUEATRI - no problem!
http://wiki.apterous.org/Episode_4097

Haha. I had actually looked at ANGRIEST prior to this show as it is very stem-rich (for some reason I also got fixated on SCENARIO), and SIGNATURE is a good example of an 'unlikely looking' stem IMO. Got more and more flustered when I couldn't even see an 8 I knew was there (was toying with RANGIEST and GRANITES but decided to play safe) to even begin looking for a 9.

Yeah I'll go with that excuse too

I rest my case!

David Williams wrote:I rest my case!

Briefcase I bet. You seem the type.

Kai Laddiman wrote:

Charlie Reams wrote:http://wiki.apterous.org/Fruitful_7s

That reminded me of the Irregular Plurals page. A few other irregular plurals I've noticed that aren't there are AMBON - AMBONES, TELAMON - TELAMONES, NOPAL - NOPALES etc.

Actually I suppose generating a list of those would be really hard.

You mean AMBO, not AMBON. Anyway stems are OK but I only use them nowadays to learn hard words, like as Charlie says GUITARS + S = SASTRUGI, because it gives me that needed edge over my opponent. Words like TARNISHED should be spotted easily without learning stems. Funny thing is, I can only spot GARBA by doing GRAB + A.

Ryan Taylor wrote:

David Williams wrote:I rest my case!

Briefcase I bet. You seem the type.

I don't know you Ryan but you sound like a grumpy young man.

David Williams wrote:

Ryan Taylor wrote:

David Williams wrote:I rest my case!

Briefcase I bet. You seem the type.

I don't know you Ryan but you sound like a grumpy young man.

I don't know you either, but you're a fine judge of character. And I wasn't even trying to be grumpy this time.

Get a room you two.

Kirk Bevins wrote:Funny thing is, I can only spot GARBA by doing GRAB + A.

Hahaha.

Charlie Reams wrote:Get a room you two.

They'd just sit in opposing corners glaring at each other. Naked.