Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

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Philip A
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Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Philip A »

Oxford Dictionaries Premium and Lexico are the two versions of Oxford Dictionaries Online (ODO). Both versions are used in the letters games on Countdown (oed.com, the Oxford English Dictionary, is not used). The contestant’s word is searched under the British English Premium first; if it does not come up as valid, it is then searched under the UK Dictionary section in Lexico. If it is valid in Lexico, then it is accepted.

This means if a word that is valid on Apterous/Countdown (or is mentioned on the show) appears to be invalid in Lexico, then it’s likely to be valid in Premium.

What are the differences between the two versions?

The main differences include the fact that Premium requires an annual paid subscription to access, whereas Lexico is free.

Premium is more accurate, reliable and voluminous than Lexico, for a number of reasons;

1) [COUNT NOUN]

Premium lists [COUNT NOUN] senses for nouns labelled [MASS NOUN], whereas Lexico tends not to give countable noun senses. This means the plural will be allowed on Countdown.

e.g. EXERTIONS

Premium:
exertion
Pronunciation: /ɪɡˈzəːʃn/
NOUN

[MASS NOUN]
1
Physical or mental effort:
she was panting with the exertion
[COUNT NOUN] : a well-earned rest after their exertions

2
The application of a force, influence, or quality:
the exertion of authority

Lexico:
exertion
Pronunciation /ɪɡˈzəːʃn/

Translate exertion into Spanish
NOUN

mass noun
1
Physical or mental effort.
‘she was panting with the exertion’

2The application of a force, influence, or quality.
‘the exertion of authority’

2) Entries from US English Dictionary under British English in Premium

The British English section in Premium contains some, but not all, words from the US English section under the British English section; these cannot be found in Lexico but will be allowed on Countdown.

e.g COQUI

Premium:
coqui
Pronunciation: /ˈkōkē/ Pronunciation: /ˈkoʊki/
Entry from US English dictionary

NOUN

A singing tree frog (Eleutherodactylus coqui), native to Puerto Rico, that has become an invasive pest in Hawaii.

Lexico:
Cannot be found https://www.lexico.com/search?utf8=%E2% ... uery=coqui

Other differences;
* Their search algorithms are slightly different; searching for a word may direct to an entry more accurately in one version than the others. (e.g. typing ‘algebras’ directs to definition 1.1 in Premium);

* Lexico previously had a few entries erroneously uncapitalised; these have since been capitalised as per Premium (e.g. Mohawk);

* ODO is regularly updated a few times per year, adding thousands of new words, but this is not always done to both versions simultaneously. The most recent update at the time of this post took action on July 2021 in Lexico only, and not in Premium. These words will be allowed on Countdown. https://www.apterous.org/ticket_view.ph ... 198#p80176
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Carl Harrison
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Carl Harrison »

Thanks Philip, interesting. Very bizarre that the Premium ("more accurate, reliable and voluminous than Lexico") still doesn't have the vast number of words added to Lexico over 3 months ago.

I'd be interested in @CountdownTeam's take on all of this. Is it really right that on the show, every time a word doesn't come up in the Premium dictionary then Susie (or the production team) then check it in Lexico as well just in case? (I guess that if that didn't happen, all these new July 2021 Lexico-only words would be at risk of being disallowed.)
Gavin Chipper
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Gavin Chipper »

I consider it to be a bad dictionary choice. Free advertising for Oxford Dictionaries, but what's in it for Countdown? I'd just swap to something else, and would have done ages ago to be honest. Some other make of dictionary might make the most of their opportunity and make the dictionary specifically Countdown-friendly in order to keep the free advertising. Oxford Dictionaries don't deserve it.
Philip A
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Philip A »

TBH, lots of dictionaries (both print and online) don’t list every single inflection, and that’s why the entry’s intention is sometimes difficult to discern (OUTLIE is especially difficult as the definition ‘to outdo in lying’ doesn’t make clear if it means to outlie geographically or tell more lies than the next person, so OUTLAIN and OUTLIED are dubious).

FTR, in my Quarter-final in 2018, when out-earn used to be valid, is was initially ruled invalid but then they cross-referenced to Lexico (was cut from broadcast to save time), where it was not hyphenated, and then they allowed it. Susie then explained to us about the two dictionaries.

I believe the lexicographer can have an incorrect validity decision overruled by the director on an earpiece.

A relevant quote from a discussion can be found here: https://www.apterous.org/ticket_view.ph ... 006#p65456

“We use the Premium version for adjudications on Countdown. If we search for a word in Premium and it isn't valid, we cross reference with the free lexico site. If it's valid in lexico, then we accept it.

We don't search specifically under the US section.”

In January 2020 Lexico separated the US Dictionary section from the UK Dictionary section so these words were deleted, including out-earn: https://www.apterous.org/ticket_view.ph ... 257#p67719
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David Williams
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by David Williams »

Yes, interesting.

It made me wonder if there are many plurals left that are allowed only because of the restaurant rule, because there is no count noun sense in examples in Premium or Lexico.
Philip A
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Philip A »

Leeway may be given for plurals of mass nouns if they are judged to be countable (if they don’t explicitly say [COUNT NOUN]). DRAINAGES (a system of drains) and TOWAGES (a charge for towing a boat) have been accepted in 2019 and 2021 respectively, even though neither have the [COUNT NOUN] label. We were recently discussing the validity of ALGEBRAS (not valid on Apterous) and we believe it’s correct to allow it by definition 1.1 ‘A system of algebra based on given axioms.’

The ‘restaurant rule’ is still there; it is based on around ordering a portion/unit of something.
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David Williams
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by David Williams »

Philip A wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 9:09 am The ‘restaurant rule’ is still there; it is based on around ordering a portion/unit of something.
In fact it's never really been about restaurants. It covers all sorts of things other than food items. But even a few years ago when I checked through the list of examples they gave, an awful lot of them already had count noun meanings listed on Lexico. If there are even more available now the restaurant rule may be redundant.

On this theme, ROOTAGES was given as valid a few weeks ago. The full Lexico entry reads "rootage NOUN See root". It has to be allowed because it isn't specified as a mass noun, but there is no clue as to what the word means. Root has several quite distinct meanings.
Philip A
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by Philip A »

Yeah it’s annoying that not all derivatives are defined. The Collins dictionary defines ROOTAGE as ‘a root system.’ https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dicti ... sh/rootage
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Re: Premium VS Lexico (Countdown’s dictionaries)

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

Some nerd (preferably from this parish) should devise a complete searchable list* of what is and is not valid for Countdown... This list should include every allowable word including all forms (plurals / comparatives / superlatives etc), be freely available online, and used by Susie, Charlie, co-event organisers etc. It can be based on OED, and updated regularly with whatever new additions / deletions are appropriate.

The multi-source confusion and on the spot 'King Solomon'-esque rulings, are not good for the game.


[*Edited to acknowledge that such a list already exists]
:arrow: :arrow: :arrow: S:778-ochamp
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