Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
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Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Tim Gregory is our new champion. Is win number 2 in the cards for him? He does have the highest score of the series thus far at 79, so maybe we can finally get a score in the 80s or higher.
Join Callum for the recap later.
Join Callum for the recap later.
Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
In round 2 Jessica found AGNISED in the ODO.
Listed as a variant spelling of the verb AGNIZE.
Means to recognise the existence of. Archaic.
AGNISE is not listed in the OED that we've got.
Mauro/Jessica
Listed as a variant spelling of the verb AGNIZE.
Means to recognise the existence of. Archaic.
AGNISE is not listed in the OED that we've got.
Mauro/Jessica
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
GOATEES, word of the match? AWESOME! (or TOWAGES, STOWAGE, GAMETES etc)
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Neither are in ODE3 - so well done!szodiac wrote:In round 2 Jessica found AGNISED in the ODO.
Listed as a variant spelling of the verb AGNIZE.
Means to recognise the existence of. Archaic.
AGNISE is not listed in the OED that we've got.
Mauro/Jessica
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
The longest word didn't make the edit - assume SPRINKLE?
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
SPUNKIER ? (as in braver)Tony Atkins wrote:The longest word didn't make the edit - assume SPRINKLE?
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Yep both - and lots of 7s.Mark Kudlowski wrote:SPUNKIER ? (as in braver)Tony Atkins wrote:The longest word didn't make the edit - assume SPRINKLE?
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
4th nos: (75-10) x 8 = 520; 9 x 3 = 27; 520-27 = 493
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
I think the conundrum has two solutions. I went for RETCONNED.
Sfumato soup
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Alt last numbers: (75+10+2)x(8+9)/3=493
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Indeed. Would have been fine as a conundrum last series.Bradley Cates wrote:I think the conundrum has two solutions. I went for RETCONNED.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Damian must be using up old ODE3 conundrums then as it is not in that but certainly in ODO.Bradley Cates wrote:I think the conundrum has two solutions. I went for RETCONNED.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Nice - I did Rachel's way - and despite what she says I think 1L is more of a gamble than some other selections.Peter Mabey wrote:Alt last numbers: (75+10+2)x(8+9)/3=493
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
The edits seem to be getting more severe in recent weeks. Could longer ad breaks and more programme plugs be the culprit ?Tony Atkins wrote:The longest word didn't make the edit - assume SPRINKLE?
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Spunkier makes more sense being editted!
A tyre can't be trod though, guess it can't be treaded either, and I went for reflush over flusher too, just seems much more likely to be in.
A tyre can't be trod though, guess it can't be treaded either, and I went for reflush over flusher too, just seems much more likely to be in.
Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
It's in CSW so are some of those words sneaking in?Tony Atkins wrote:Neither are in ODE3 - so well done!szodiac wrote:In round 2 Jessica found AGNISED in the ODO.
Listed as a variant spelling of the verb AGNIZE.
Means to recognise the existence of. Archaic.
AGNISE is not listed in the OED that we've got.
Mauro/Jessica
But wait... in round 5 the MOOTED round. Champion's word DATER is in ODO but not in our OED!?!?! Are Susie and Jessica using the same Oxford dictionary on line?
Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
OK Jessica again! In this round Susie disallowed LUPINES.Tony Atkins wrote:The longest word didn't make the edit - assume SPRINKLE?
Jessica *found* LUPINES listed under LUPIN in the ODO (and OED). (Susie may have just typed Lupine and looked for an S hook)
Jessica had to type in the *whole* word into the text box on the website.
This took her to the right definition which listed LUPINE as a variant spelling of LUPIN which defines it as a pea-plant.
Errrrmmm
Mauro/Jessica
ps: who should think Jessica should apply for the DC opening when it becomes available?
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
ODO says LUPINE is a North American spelling of LUPIN though, which is probably why it wasn't allowed.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Griff Rhys Jones seemed to be trying to ask Susie why non-words (such as acronyms) were in the dictionary but she was in a bit of a world of her own.
Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
It all depends on how Susie looked it up. I believe she looked up LUPINE as in wolflike and not LUPINE as in 'see LUPIN' plant. She did give the definition as "pertaining to wolf"Innis Carson wrote:ODO says LUPINE is a North American spelling of LUPIN though, which is probably why it wasn't allowed.
We might never know. There is a little 2 above the word Lupine on the right hand side of the ODO in the 'see also' section which she may or may not have noticed.
US spellings are currently marked and not allowed like FAVOR^.
The listing definition would suggest to me it's a North American word as opposed to a North American spelling.
It's going to be a while before we'll get to grasp, and navigate around, the ODO fully methinks
Mauro/Jessica
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
It says North American not US and I think it's only US spellings that are disallowed. It is also not listed as a spelling and has its own pronunciation listed so it's arguably a separate term. LUPINES should be valid and looking up the declared word should be done as default. So what Mauro says really.Innis Carson wrote:ODO says LUPINE is a North American spelling of LUPIN though, which is probably why it wasn't allowed.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
According to what Charlie has been saying in ODO list maker on Apterous, North American spellings are now not allowed, as well as US spellings, so Susie was correct this time.Gavin Chipper wrote:It says North American not US and I think it's only US spellings that are disallowed. It is also not listed as a spelling and has its own pronunciation listed so it's arguably a separate term. LUPINES should be valid and looking up the declared word should be done as default. So what Mauro says really.Innis Carson wrote:ODO says LUPINE is a North American spelling of LUPIN though, which is probably why it wasn't allowed.
BORANES in round 8, FOREIGN/GENITOR/TRIGONE in round 11 and INTRADOS in round 13.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
It's listed "as a spelling" in the same way that alternative spellings always are, and it would be weird for the fact that it's also pronounced differently to make a difference. No substantive difference is outlined between LUPINE (in this sense) and LUPIN. And yes, it's been intimated elsewhere that 'North American' spellings are officially disallowed now too, though you wouldn't have been able to see that in fairness. I'm in two minds about whether or not I agree with the rule, but given that it's in place, I think this was a justifiable ruling.Gavin Chipper wrote:It is also not listed as a spelling and has its own pronunciation listed so it's arguably a separate term.
Reading too much into what we think Susie did to check the word is fairly pointless too considering there's a good chance what we saw is a retake. I'd be surprised if this didn't cause any discussion at the time of recording.
Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
The ambiguity lies in the fact that the entry for LUPINE lists it neither as a "term" or "spelling" just North American.Gavin Chipper wrote:It is also not listed as a spelling and has its own pronunciation listed so it's arguably a separate term.
If you look at the entries for SIDEWALK and CELLPHONE. They are also listed as North American. So they'll not be allowed then!
Then I had a look at other words to see what ODO says: CARIBOU (US term), TATTLETALE (US spelling), GARBAGE (North American).
Sorry I'm just trying to make sense of which are allowed and which are not according to ODO.
Hope we don't get into this trouble at CoStAl this Saturday
Mauro/Jessica
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
The rule has always been a bit fuzzy and I'm not sure if there'll be any objective way of distinguishing between 'spellings' and 'words' that will never go wrong, but I find that alternative spellings tend to be given in brackets under the headword but before the entry, such as with FLAVOR and ANEMIC. If it says "US" or "North American" here, then I'd be inclined to call it an American spelling and disallow it. If the "US" or "North American" tag appears with no brackets in the section containing definitions, such as with DUMPSTER or JELLO, then it's more likely to be indicating the regional usage of a distinct word with a distinct meaning, and those are allowable. Going by this, all of Mauro's examples are allowable, but LUPINES isn't. I realise this is all very arbitrary, but it would be nice to put together some kind of objective way of judging this, and in all cases I can think of off the top of my head, this way is consistent with past rulings and with intuition - though there could well be counterexamples and I'd be interested to see them.
Last edited by Innis Carson on Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
My worry was that although it's listed as alternative spellings always are, it's also listed as alternative terms are since it doesn't seem to make an explicit difference. Being pronounced differently means it's more than a different spelling.Innis Carson wrote:It's listed "as a spelling" in the same way that alternative spellings always are, and it would be weird for the fact that it's also pronounced differently to make a difference.
You might be right. In the NODE, HAULER is right next to HAULIER, and it has its own entry saying that it's a North American term. It also has its own entry in the ODO. So maybe if it's a term they'll explicitly say so, but it if it's a spelling then they won't.The rule has always been a bit fuzzy and I'm not sure if there'll be any objective way of distinguishing between 'spellings' and 'words' that will never go wrong, but I find that alternative spellings tend to be given in brackets under the headword but before the entry, such as with FLAVOR and ANEMIC.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
If I'm understanding you correctly, some examples which appear as spelling variants but which might be considered substantively different from their UK forms are aluminum, apothegm, behoove and tidbit. There used to be zibet/zibeth but they seem to have disappeared.Innis Carson wrote:... there could well be counterexamples and I'd be interested to see them.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
But FLUSHER also means "having more money".Philip Wilson wrote:I went for reflush over flusher too, just seems much more likely to be in.
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Re: Spoilers for Tuesday July 8th 2014 (S71 P7)
Didn't think of that until after I wrote the msg tbh, so long after watching the matchDavid Williams wrote:But FLUSHER also means "having more money".Philip Wilson wrote:I went for reflush over flusher too, just seems much more likely to be in.